MBA/MSc in Germany/France/Netherlands


BEAST

Hello All,

I'm an Indian national having a Masters in Biotechnology and 3.5 years work ex in a Pharma Start-up (Business Dev & Operations). I plan to move into Operations/Consulting sector within Germany [Pharma/Biotech/Healthcare]. I've lived in Germany in the past and have intermediate Deutsch (B-1, will complete B2 by Oct-Nov & continue further). I also know intermediate French.
Currently I have the following offers:
1) HHL Leipzig MBA
2) IESEG Paris MBA
3) TIAS MBA
And awaiting: ESSEC (Smib program)
EBS MBA, ESB Reutlingen & Cologne Business School MBA

My questions are:
1) What should the order of schools be in Germany, from the abovementioned options, in-line for my career goals & financials(very imp, hence applied to EBS, ESb, etc)?
2) Would a brand name justify the high costs, especially in France [ESSEC]?
3) Would it be more beneficial for me to go for an MSc rather than an MBA considering my little work ex?

Any other suggestions are highly welcome. I've to choose between these schools in the next week or so. Thank you for all the help in advance.

- Anshul

Hello All,

I'm an Indian national having a Masters in Biotechnology and 3.5 years work ex in a Pharma Start-up (Business Dev & Operations). I plan to move into Operations/Consulting sector within Germany [Pharma/Biotech/Healthcare]. I've lived in Germany in the past and have intermediate Deutsch (B-1, will complete B2 by Oct-Nov & continue further). I also know intermediate French.
Currently I have the following offers:
1) HHL Leipzig MBA
2) IESEG Paris MBA
3) TIAS MBA
And awaiting: ESSEC (Smib program)
EBS MBA, ESB Reutlingen & Cologne Business School MBA

My questions are:
1) What should the order of schools be in Germany, from the abovementioned options, in-line for my career goals & financials(very imp, hence applied to EBS, ESb, etc)?
2) Would a brand name justify the high costs, especially in France [ESSEC]?
3) Would it be more beneficial for me to go for an MSc rather than an MBA considering my little work ex?

Any other suggestions are highly welcome. I've to choose between these schools in the next week or so. Thank you for all the help in advance.

- Anshul
quote
Duncan

I think International students in France generally speak better French than those in Germany speak German. So Germany seems more promising than France or The Netherlands. Otherwise, the quality of the school is more important than the choice of MBA or MSc. I would exclude the weaker schools, EBS and Cologne, if your focus is on finding work.

I think International students in France generally speak better French than those in Germany speak German. So Germany seems more promising than France or The Netherlands. Otherwise, the quality of the school is more important than the choice of MBA or MSc. I would exclude the weaker schools, EBS and Cologne, if your focus is on finding work.
quote
BEAST

I think International students in France generally speak better French than those in Germany speak German. So Germany seems more promising than France or The Netherlands. Otherwise, the quality of the school is more important than the choice of MBA or MSc. I would exclude the weaker schools, EBS and Cologne, if your focus is on finding work.


Absolutely well said Duncan! I'm inclined to work in Germany. That has been my calling ever since I lived there. In what aspects do you think EBS is a weaker school than ESB? Also are schools like HFU (furtwangen) & Offenburg are worth applying for?

[quote]I think International students in France generally speak better French than those in Germany speak German. So Germany seems more promising than France or The Netherlands. Otherwise, the quality of the school is more important than the choice of MBA or MSc. I would exclude the weaker schools, EBS and Cologne, if your focus is on finding work. [/quote]<br><br>Absolutely well said Duncan! I'm inclined to work in Germany. That has been my calling ever since I lived there. In what aspects do you think EBS is a weaker school than ESB? Also are schools like HFU (furtwangen) &amp; Offenburg are worth applying for?
quote
Duncan

I think you can search the board for discussion of those schools. I have nothing much to add. HHL and ESB are so much better than the other German schools you mention. 

I think you can search the board for discussion of those schools. I have nothing much to add. HHL and ESB are so much better than the other German schools you mention.&nbsp;
quote
BEAST


Thanks for the feedback Duncan! I just thought that EBS has greater employer partnerships and hence would be a better target school for my career goal achievements.
Nevertheless, I get what you are saying. Will hope to get adit into ESB!


<div><br></div><div>Thanks for the feedback Duncan! I just thought that EBS has greater employer partnerships and hence would be a better target school for my career goal achievements.
</div><div>Nevertheless, I get what you are saying. Will hope to get adit into ESB!
</div><div><br></div><div>
</div><div>
</div><div>
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quote
Duncan

Yeah, reading this forum and others will really help you. EBS is widely discussed. 

Yeah, reading this forum and others will really help you. EBS is widely discussed.&nbsp;
quote
BEAST

Yes, I will do that. Also, if I do choose ESB over HHL (due to pure financials), what are the things/variables I would have to scacrifice? [the difference in Investment is more than double at HHL] - Alumni, Career opportunity, etc?. Thank you Duncan for your immense feedbacks!

Yes, I will do that. Also, if I do choose ESB over HHL (due to pure financials), what are the things/variables I would have to scacrifice? [the difference in Investment is more than double at HHL] - Alumni, Career opportunity, etc?. Thank you Duncan for your immense feedbacks!
quote
Duncan

Yes, HHL has a more active alumni network, much higher salary and better outcomes, better students, more interactive teaching, and a longer format to allow higher German language skills. It's worth the extra investment. 

Yes, HHL has a more active alumni network, much higher salary and better outcomes, better students, more interactive teaching, and a longer format to allow higher German language skills. It's worth the extra investment.&nbsp;
quote
BEAST

Got it. As for the UK job market, would you suggest Leeds, Aston, Bath & Lancaster [MSc] if one wants a career in Consulting? I'm contemplating to apply to some UK schools as well.

Got it. As for the UK job market, would you suggest Leeds, Aston, Bath &amp; Lancaster [MSc] if one wants a career in Consulting? I'm contemplating to apply to some UK schools as well.
quote
Duncan

Depending on the sort of consulting you want. LBS, ESCP, Imperial, Warwick and Bayes are where the top firms go. I;d say the second tier is Bath, Cranfield, Edinburgh, Lancaster. 

Depending on the sort of consulting you want. LBS, ESCP, Imperial, Warwick and Bayes are where the top firms go. I;d say the second tier is Bath, Cranfield, Edinburgh, Lancaster.&nbsp;
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BEAST

I applied for the MSc Consulting at Leeds but don't you think I will be overage in the MSc Management at Bath/Lancaster? Also, MiM is a generalist program. I already have a tech masters. Wouldn't a specialised masters (at Leeds) give me more leverage in the Consulti ng domain? [Life sciences/STrategy)

I applied for the MSc Consulting at Leeds but don't you think I will be overage in the MSc Management at Bath/Lancaster? Also, MiM is a generalist program. I already have a tech masters. Wouldn't a specialised masters (at Leeds) give me more leverage in the Consulti ng domain? [Life sciences/STrategy)
quote
Duncan

It sounds like you need to spend more time to use LinkedIn to see which of these programmes places best into the firms and roles you are focussed on. Take a look at my profile page for the post about LinkedIn. 

It sounds like you need to spend more time to use LinkedIn to see which of these programmes places best into the firms and roles you are focussed on. Take a look at my profile page for the post about LinkedIn.&nbsp;
quote
BEAST

Hi Duncan!

Have the following offers, shortlisted: HHL, EBS, ESB - All MBA & CASS (MSc). WHat should be the order of these four when placing importance on Career outcomes &Financials (huge difference - 25000 euros! in Germany)?

Would need your input and methodology of guaging programs from above. I've talked to alumni from all three schools. Still need your perspective.

Hi Duncan!<br><br>Have the following offers, shortlisted: HHL, EBS, ESB - All MBA &amp; CASS (MSc). WHat should be the order of these four when placing importance on Career outcomes &amp;Financials (huge difference - 25000 euros! in Germany)?<br><br>Would need your input and methodology of guaging programs from above. I've talked to alumni from all three schools. Still need your perspective.
quote
Duncan

Predictably, HHL > ESB > Bayes > EBS. 

[Edited by Duncan on May 29, 2021]

Predictably, HHL &gt; ESB &gt; Bayes &gt; EBS.&nbsp;
quote
BEAST

I know you mentioned benefits of HHL over ESB. Do you think with internmediate German skills at present (will be B2 by Sep 2021), it makes sense to shell out 25k extra at HHL?

I know you mentioned benefits of HHL over ESB. Do you think with internmediate German skills at present (will be B2 by Sep 2021), it makes sense to shell out 25k extra at HHL?
quote
Duncan

At the risk of repeating what I wrote on the 24th: The added benefit of HHL is worth much more than €25k. ESB is certainly the leading public business school in Baden-Württemberg, but the salary premium is very modest even from the MBA. HHL is a world-class business school with incomparable elan and network power. 

[Edited by Duncan on May 29, 2021]

At the risk of repeating what I wrote on the 24th: The added benefit of HHL is worth much more than €25k. ESB is certainly the leading public business school in Baden-Württemberg, but the salary premium is very modest even from the MBA. HHL is a world-class business school with incomparable elan and network power.&nbsp;
quote
BEAST

What exactly does Network power relate to? I did LinkedIn research on both the schools and found people to be working at same positions in Consulting (my area). How should I then judge both these programs? Thanks!

What exactly does Network power relate to? I did LinkedIn research on both the schools and found people to be working at same positions in Consulting (my area). How should I then judge both these programs? Thanks!
quote
Duncan

Well, you are not wrong. HHL won't be stronger in every area. ESB is a larger and older school so it naturally has more alumni. But to look at network power: for example, HHL has 21 DE MC alumni with MBAs at the CXO or VP level while ESB has 15. HHL alumni tend to be in firms under 5000 people, and are more likely to be in business development role. ESB people in DE MC are more often in operations, marketing or art and design roles. ESB also has many more DE alumni with MBAs working in mature industry: automative, machinery, retail, meedical devices and chemicals. HHL is more in banking, IT, financial services, internet, telecoms, start-ups and scales ups etc. 

Well, you are not wrong. HHL won't be stronger in every area. ESB is a larger and older school so it naturally has more alumni. But to look at network power: for example, HHL has 21 DE MC alumni with MBAs at the CXO or VP level while ESB has 15. HHL alumni tend to be in firms under 5000 people, and are more likely to be in business development role. ESB people in DE MC are more often in operations, marketing or art and design roles. ESB also has many more DE alumni with MBAs working in mature industry: automative, machinery, retail, meedical devices and chemicals. HHL is more in banking, IT, financial services, internet, telecoms, start-ups and scales ups etc.&nbsp;
quote
BEAST

Well said. So if my target companies are Biotech/Pharma/Healthcare companies and function/role is Consulting/operations, ESB looks a better prospect than HHL?

Well said. So if my target companies are Biotech/Pharma/Healthcare companies and function/role is Consulting/operations, ESB looks a better prospect than HHL?
quote
Duncan

No, it looks very similar to me. If you look ESB in the round: much lower quality students, a shorter study period, greatly inferior resources, weaker support for improving your German.... I could not honestly recommend ESB over HHL to an internatuonal student. 

No, it looks very similar to me. If you look ESB in the round: much lower quality students, a shorter study period, greatly inferior resources, weaker support for improving your German.... I could not honestly recommend ESB over HHL to an internatuonal student.&nbsp;
quote

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