Dilemma: MBA in Germany


Hello everybody.

I am in a dilemma and I wonder if anybody could be able to genuinely help me out.
I received admit from the below listed universities :
1. HFU, Furtwangen - MBA International Business
2. IUBH, Bad Honeff - MBA International Business
3. HTW, Berlin - MBA&E - Automotive Managment
4. IGC HS, Bremen - MBA Global Management

Kindly suggest which university is better along with the course and location of study. Also, kindly advise me on post MBA job scenario in Germany.
Looking forward to your useful inputs and information.
Hello everybody.

I am in a dilemma and I wonder if anybody could be able to genuinely help me out.
I received admit from the below listed universities :
1. HFU, Furtwangen - MBA International Business
2. IUBH, Bad Honeff - MBA International Business
3. HTW, Berlin - MBA&E - Automotive Managment
4. IGC HS, Bremen - MBA Global Management

Kindly suggest which university is better along with the course and location of study. Also, kindly advise me on post MBA job scenario in Germany.
Looking forward to your useful inputs and information.
quote
Dan85
Do you speak German?
Do you speak German?
quote
@Dan85 No i don't, i have completed A1 level and would be starting with A2 soon.
@Dan85 No i don't, i have completed A1 level and would be starting with A2 soon.
quote
Duncan
Job situation will be very limited from all these schools without fluent business German. Furtwangen at least is in an economically dynamic region. Why study German at a German university for a year and then take a free MSc taught in German? It will be cheaper and more effective.
Job situation will be very limited from all these schools without fluent business German. Furtwangen at least is in an economically dynamic region. Why study German at a German university for a year and then take a free MSc taught in German? It will be cheaper and more effective.
quote
Dan85
Plus (from my perspective as a German), MBA as a degree is not held in particularly high regard among employers in Germany unless obtained from a high-profile school.

Traditionally and typically, people hold MSc or equivalent degrees here.
Plus (from my perspective as a German), MBA as a degree is not held in particularly high regard among employers in Germany unless obtained from a high-profile school.

Traditionally and typically, people hold MSc or equivalent degrees here.
quote
@Duncan and Dan85: Thank you for the prompt reply. I'm not currently in a situation to opt out & look for another course and will have to join either of the course coming October. So I would really request you to kindly throw some light on the above listed universities itself. Majorly, I'm confused between Furtwangen and IUBH. Also, IUBH has given me an option to opt for either their Bad Honeff campus or Berlin campus. As per you, which would be better?
@Duncan and Dan85: Thank you for the prompt reply. I'm not currently in a situation to opt out & look for another course and will have to join either of the course coming October. So I would really request you to kindly throw some light on the above listed universities itself. Majorly, I'm confused between Furtwangen and IUBH. Also, IUBH has given me an option to opt for either their Bad Honeff campus or Berlin campus. As per you, which would be better?
quote
Dan85
What are your goals post-MBA?
What are your goals post-MBA?
quote
Duncan
Whichever location, I recommend that you go crazy over the next year to perfect your German, spend time with Germans and lose your accent when speaking German. Live with a host family, not in an international residence, and network with Germans.

Bad Honnef will be better than Berlin for work and for learning German. You are so close to Bonn and the industrial and commercial heartland of Germany north of there. It's already such a challenge when you will be in an English-language campus like IUBH, but at least off-campus you will have to speak some German. In Berlin you'll be able to not speak German at all.

In Bremen, again, the IGC is an English-speaking building a little distance from the main campus, but at least there is a campus with low-level German classes.

Furtwagen seems to have the most intensive German classes, and the campus is German-speaking, so I would pick this from the options.

The alternative option is to pick the opposite strategy, which would be risky: Go to Berlin and try to find other foreigners with English-speaking businesses.
Whichever location, I recommend that you go crazy over the next year to perfect your German, spend time with Germans and lose your accent when speaking German. Live with a host family, not in an international residence, and network with Germans.

Bad Honnef will be better than Berlin for work and for learning German. You are so close to Bonn and the industrial and commercial heartland of Germany north of there. It's already such a challenge when you will be in an English-language campus like IUBH, but at least off-campus you will have to speak some German. In Berlin you'll be able to not speak German at all.

In Bremen, again, the IGC is an English-speaking building a little distance from the main campus, but at least there is a campus with low-level German classes.

Furtwagen seems to have the most intensive German classes, and the campus is German-speaking, so I would pick this from the options.

The alternative option is to pick the opposite strategy, which would be risky: Go to Berlin and try to find other foreigners with English-speaking businesses.
quote
To be frank, I'm not sure about my post MBA goals as I come from engineering background. I decided to switch to a management background so that I can broaden my skills in business management and ultimately get a decent job. Simply I want to change career. But yes certainly I have interest in financial services and consulting.
To be frank, I'm not sure about my post MBA goals as I come from engineering background. I decided to switch to a management background so that I can broaden my skills in business management and ultimately get a decent job. Simply I want to change career. But yes certainly I have interest in financial services and consulting.
quote
@Duncan: I can clearly see that you have given quite a lot of information. Thank you.
@Duncan: I can clearly see that you have given quite a lot of information. Thank you.
quote
Duncan
Please take a look at Do you need to speak the local language? www.find-mba.com/board/34713

I appreciate that people have lots of reason for wanting to move fast, but I hope you can see that you have the opportunity to address some weaknesses
- Not schools with meaningful international accreditation
- Weak careers services for international students
- Programmes with very few Germans
- German language skills are not an intensive part of the programme
- not in the main German business centres (Munich, Frankfurt, Duesseldorf, Cologne etc).

I guess you are at these schools because you think there's nowhere better you can get in to. AT IUBH you'd have the nicest campus experience. Furtwagen will be the most German experience.

Could you not postpone a little? WHU starts in March https://www.whu.edu/en/programs/mba-program/
Please take a look at Do you need to speak the local language? www.find-mba.com/board/34713

I appreciate that people have lots of reason for wanting to move fast, but I hope you can see that you have the opportunity to address some weaknesses
- Not schools with meaningful international accreditation
- Weak careers services for international students
- Programmes with very few Germans
- German language skills are not an intensive part of the programme
- not in the main German business centres (Munich, Frankfurt, Duesseldorf, Cologne etc).

I guess you are at these schools because you think there's nowhere better you can get in to. AT IUBH you'd have the nicest campus experience. Furtwagen will be the most German experience.

Could you not postpone a little? WHU starts in March https://www.whu.edu/en/programs/mba-program/
quote
turnup
If it comes down to MBA programes in germany there are in my opinion only two valid choices. That is Mannheim or WHU.
The value of the MBA comes from the brand of the business school, since the degree as such has no academic relevance and is not governed by many restrictions like a PhD. Therefore the Brand and the ranking within the world or europe is very very important.

The second most important thing is the community or albumin network that you join. You want a diverse school with people from germany but also from other country's if possible. In addition higher valued schools draw on students that are high achievers. This also is very important because you learn much from your colleges within the program as well and hopefully build lasting relationships.

I did not mention the skills thought in the MBA - the answer why is simple : skills can be learned by everyone but the experience you make within the courses and the relationships/network that you bring to the table is unique to you.

I would recommend Mannheim or WHU or go even further and join ESADE, Bocconi, HEC, LBS or HSG (Sankt Gallen if you prefer more german speaking regions), IMD is also a very valid choice.

In addition dont go for a "specialized MBA" this is the greatest ruse in the last years of MBA programmes, the value lies within being a generalist not a specialist if you choose this path.

see also Havard Business Review - Why generalists get better job offers

https://hbr.org/2016/06/generalists-get-better-job-offers-than-specialists?utm_campaign=HBR&utm_source=linkedin&utm_medium=social
If it comes down to MBA programes in germany there are in my opinion only two valid choices. That is Mannheim or WHU.
The value of the MBA comes from the brand of the business school, since the degree as such has no academic relevance and is not governed by many restrictions like a PhD. Therefore the Brand and the ranking within the world or europe is very very important.

The second most important thing is the community or albumin network that you join. You want a diverse school with people from germany but also from other country's if possible. In addition higher valued schools draw on students that are high achievers. This also is very important because you learn much from your colleges within the program as well and hopefully build lasting relationships.

I did not mention the skills thought in the MBA - the answer why is simple : skills can be learned by everyone but the experience you make within the courses and the relationships/network that you bring to the table is unique to you.

I would recommend Mannheim or WHU or go even further and join ESADE, Bocconi, HEC, LBS or HSG (Sankt Gallen if you prefer more german speaking regions), IMD is also a very valid choice.

In addition dont go for a "specialized MBA" this is the greatest ruse in the last years of MBA programmes, the value lies within being a generalist not a specialist if you choose this path.

see also Havard Business Review - Why generalists get better job offers

https://hbr.org/2016/06/generalists-get-better-job-offers-than-specialists?utm_campaign=HBR&utm_source=linkedin&utm_medium=social
quote
Duncan
I think it's good to prioritise Mannheim and WHU for the MSc, but the evidence shows that brand alone isn't the key thing for the MBA. Compare the FT rankings: https://www.dropbox.com/s/wtezmyh2826h8at/Screenshot%202016-06-13%2021.30.51.png?dl=0 ESMT and HHL do very well.

ESMT and HHL benefit from very strong connections with employers and they attract less conventional applicants.

PS Maury makes an excellent point below; ESMT clearly outperforms WHU for most MAB students, especially those with above-average work experience.

[Edited by Duncan on Jun 15, 2016]

I think it's good to prioritise Mannheim and WHU for the MSc, but the evidence shows that brand alone isn't the key thing for the MBA. Compare the FT rankings: https://www.dropbox.com/s/wtezmyh2826h8at/Screenshot%202016-06-13%2021.30.51.png?dl=0 ESMT and HHL do very well.

ESMT and HHL benefit from very strong connections with employers and they attract less conventional applicants.

PS Maury makes an excellent point below; ESMT clearly outperforms WHU for most MAB students, especially those with above-average work experience.
quote
maury
If it comes down to MBA programes in germany there are in my opinion only two valid choices. That is Mannheim or WHU.

Good programs but hardly the only ones worth doing. ESMT, HHL and now Frankfurt School. In fact, if I were looking for an MBA in Germany I'd prioritize ESMT over WHU, in fact.
[quote]If it comes down to MBA programes in germany there are in my opinion only two valid choices. That is Mannheim or WHU.[/quote]
Good programs but hardly the only ones worth doing. ESMT, HHL and now Frankfurt School. In fact, if I were looking for an MBA in Germany I'd prioritize ESMT over WHU, in fact.
quote
If it comes down to MBA programes in germany there are in my opinion only two valid choices. That is Mannheim or WHU.

Good programs but hardly the only ones worth doing. ESMT, HHL and now Frankfurt School. In fact, if I were looking for an MBA in Germany I'd prioritize ESMT over WHU, in fact.


ESMT is only good if you want to still continue with IT field and have substantial experience.
[quote][quote]If it comes down to MBA programes in germany there are in my opinion only two valid choices. That is Mannheim or WHU.[/quote]
Good programs but hardly the only ones worth doing. ESMT, HHL and now Frankfurt School. In fact, if I were looking for an MBA in Germany I'd prioritize ESMT over WHU, in fact.
[/quote]

ESMT is only good if you want to still continue with IT field and have substantial experience.
quote
Nour Douba
I got admitted into both IUBH and HTW Berlin as well, I want to study in Berlin exclusively so I did some research and I found that :

-IUBH is a private university sponsored by a GmbH company, while HTW Berlin is a public university
-HTW Berlin is much more known to employees,
-The university's ranking is higher than IUBH in all ranking indices I found,
-I felt that they have a more solid program, and I contacted many Alumni who were satisfied with the program quality
- Accreditation wise, I'm not very clear on which accreditation is better: IUBH is accredited by FIBAA while HTW Berlin MBA&E is accredited by ACQUIN and AQAS, I understand all of these accreditation bodies are not international but it doesn't matter to me since I am planning to work in Germany
- And eventually both programs cost about the same amount and last for 3 semesters,

So I opted for HTW Berlin, please correct me or let me know if my comparison is flawed or if I ignored any other aspects!
I got admitted into both IUBH and HTW Berlin as well, I want to study in Berlin exclusively so I did some research and I found that :

-IUBH is a private university sponsored by a GmbH company, while HTW Berlin is a public university
-HTW Berlin is much more known to employees,
-The university's ranking is higher than IUBH in all ranking indices I found,
-I felt that they have a more solid program, and I contacted many Alumni who were satisfied with the program quality
- Accreditation wise, I'm not very clear on which accreditation is better: IUBH is accredited by FIBAA while HTW Berlin MBA&E is accredited by ACQUIN and AQAS, I understand all of these accreditation bodies are not international but it doesn't matter to me since I am planning to work in Germany
- And eventually both programs cost about the same amount and last for 3 semesters,

So I opted for HTW Berlin, please correct me or let me know if my comparison is flawed or if I ignored any other aspects!
quote
laurie

-IUBH is a private university sponsored by a GmbH company, while HTW Berlin is a public university

I'm not sure that in Germany, that's necessarily a bad thing: ESMT is also a private school and sponsored by a range of GmbH's but is quite respected by employers.
[quote]
-IUBH is a private university sponsored by a GmbH company, while HTW Berlin is a public university
[/quote]
I'm not sure that in Germany, that's necessarily a bad thing: ESMT is also a private school and sponsored by a range of GmbH's but is quite respected by employers.
quote
Nour Douba

I'm not sure that in Germany, that's necessarily a bad thing: ESMT is also a private school and sponsored by a range of GmbH's but is quite respected by employers.


You're right, it may not be a very bad thing, but in my opinion a non-profit public university or a university sponsored by many companies is more stable than a private university sponsored by one company.
[quote]
I'm not sure that in Germany, that's necessarily a bad thing: ESMT is also a private school and sponsored by a range of GmbH's but is quite respected by employers.[/quote]

You're right, it may not be a very bad thing, but in my opinion a non-profit public university or a university sponsored by many companies is more stable than a private university sponsored by one company.
quote
Elisa
In my opinion, German business language skills are useful but not fundamentally necessary. There are a lot of international companies in Germany that use English as their internal language. Furthermore, I think studying in a German business center does not provide any real advantages because there will be a lot of students applying for jobs after their studies. I know that in the cities you mentioned, there are a lot of very good companies that look for international students, especially with a master's degree.
Concerning the accreditation, I know that German accreditation is highly valuable and has a very good quality.
I suggest you choose the program that most matches your interests and your future career goals.

[Edited by Elisa on Jun 16, 2016]

In my opinion, German business language skills are useful but not fundamentally necessary. There are a lot of international companies in Germany that use English as their internal language. Furthermore, I think studying in a German business center does not provide any real advantages because there will be a lot of students applying for jobs after their studies. I know that in the cities you mentioned, there are a lot of very good companies that look for international students, especially with a master's degree.
Concerning the accreditation, I know that German accreditation is highly valuable and has a very good quality.
I suggest you choose the program that most matches your interests and your future career goals.
quote
laurie
To be clear:

AACSB is an institutional accreditation and not a programatic accreditation - a program cannot be accredited by AACSB in the way that it can be by AMBA.

So that program you mention is not "accredited" by AACSB - one of IGC's partner institutions has AACSB accreditation. There is a difference.
To be clear:

AACSB is an institutional accreditation and not a programatic accreditation - a program cannot be accredited by AACSB in the way that it can be by AMBA.

So that program you mention is not "accredited" by AACSB - one of IGC's partner institutions has AACSB accreditation. There is a difference.
quote

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