Disadvantages of MiM over MBA in Germany


Raku
Hi everybody,
I have applied to a no. of MIM and International Business programmes in Germany for the Winter intake 2016. Some of them are (all English Track):
1. Mannheim MIM - Result Awaited
2. Technical University of Munich MIM - Result Awaited
3. University of Erlangen - International Business - Result Awaited
4. Leuphana University- Management in Data Science - Result Awaited
5. Berlin School of Economics and Law - International Business & Consulting - Strategic Management - Result Awaited
6. HS Esslingen - International Industrial Management - Already received the offer letter

The reasons I have selected the above programmes are :
1. I want to settle in Germany (fell in love with Europe while travelling)
2. Don't have a lot of money ( already paying my last student loan, can't take loan any more)
3. Have already studied Management once and would like to stick with the domain

My profile:
-Age 26.5 Years
-Production & Industrial Engineer >> 1.75 years in power plant operations >> MBA (2 year) from IIM Calcutta (the programme is ranked 16th in FT MiM 2015 rankings >> Management Trainee at Engine Manufacturing Company for 1 year
- GMAT score of 720 with perfect AWA and IR scores
- Just Started learning German A1

A lot of my friends are telling me that I am letting go of a wonderful career in India ( this is more or less assured after a degree from IIM C which is treated like Harvard in India) and risking everything for a very uncertain (low chances of jobs) and mediocre career(even if I get a job) in Germany.

I don't mind sacrificing all this if I have sufficient chance of landing a job in Germany after my degree (18 - 24 months course duration, full time) so that I get a work visa (I need starting gross salary of 50,000 Euro/ year).

Do I stand a chance of selection into the above programmes ? And if selected, do I stand a chance of securing the must needed 50k Euro job after my degree ?

I would be very glad and thankful for any advice or views on my situation irrespective of the comment being for/against my decision. Thanks in advance. Sorry for the long post.
Hi everybody,
I have applied to a no. of MIM and International Business programmes in Germany for the Winter intake 2016. Some of them are (all English Track):
1. Mannheim MIM - Result Awaited
2. Technical University of Munich MIM - Result Awaited
3. University of Erlangen - International Business - Result Awaited
4. Leuphana University- Management in Data Science - Result Awaited
5. Berlin School of Economics and Law - International Business & Consulting - Strategic Management - Result Awaited
6. HS Esslingen - International Industrial Management - Already received the offer letter

The reasons I have selected the above programmes are :
1. I want to settle in Germany (fell in love with Europe while travelling)
2. Don't have a lot of money ( already paying my last student loan, can't take loan any more)
3. Have already studied Management once and would like to stick with the domain

My profile:
-Age 26.5 Years
-Production & Industrial Engineer >> 1.75 years in power plant operations >> MBA (2 year) from IIM Calcutta (the programme is ranked 16th in FT MiM 2015 rankings >> Management Trainee at Engine Manufacturing Company for 1 year
- GMAT score of 720 with perfect AWA and IR scores
- Just Started learning German A1

A lot of my friends are telling me that I am letting go of a wonderful career in India ( this is more or less assured after a degree from IIM C which is treated like Harvard in India) and risking everything for a very uncertain (low chances of jobs) and mediocre career(even if I get a job) in Germany.

I don't mind sacrificing all this if I have sufficient chance of landing a job in Germany after my degree (18 - 24 months course duration, full time) so that I get a work visa (I need starting gross salary of 50,000 Euro/ year).

Do I stand a chance of selection into the above programmes ? And if selected, do I stand a chance of securing the must needed 50k Euro job after my degree ?

I would be very glad and thankful for any advice or views on my situation irrespective of the comment being for/against my decision. Thanks in advance. Sorry for the long post.
quote
Duncan
You have an amazing qualification from the IIMC: I think there is little that you learn from those schools academically.

Do you speak German? If you are admitted to Esslingen, then you perhaps have around 200 hours. Without fluent German I don't see what you can do.
You have an amazing qualification from the IIMC: I think there is little that you learn from those schools academically.

Do you speak German? If you are admitted to Esslingen, then you perhaps have around 200 hours. Without fluent German I don't see what you can do.
quote
Raku
No, I disagree. Though IIM C is famous but the student crowd is very similar in every sense. Everybody is a geek, the students are mostly engineers like me. It lacks diversity and international exposure which limits my management skills academically as well as culturally. Even if we leave all this, I am not betting my everything for better academic education. I visited Germany only because of my German friends and fell in love with the place. Decided that I will risk everything if I have a good enough chance to settle in Germany.
No, I have just started with my German A1 .. I am ready to fight it out in the next two years to learn as much German as I can. But I don't know if it is even possible to speak fluent enough in two years with MBA classes going in parallel.

Considering I reach B2 in two years with decent acads and a German degree, what are my chances of getting a job of 50k euro ? Is there any other way of pulling this whole thing off without a big financial dent or a super crazy risk ?
No, I disagree. Though IIM C is famous but the student crowd is very similar in every sense. Everybody is a geek, the students are mostly engineers like me. It lacks diversity and international exposure which limits my management skills academically as well as culturally. Even if we leave all this, I am not betting my everything for better academic education. I visited Germany only because of my German friends and fell in love with the place. Decided that I will risk everything if I have a good enough chance to settle in Germany.
No, I have just started with my German A1 .. I am ready to fight it out in the next two years to learn as much German as I can. But I don't know if it is even possible to speak fluent enough in two years with MBA classes going in parallel.

Considering I reach B2 in two years with decent acads and a German degree, what are my chances of getting a job of 50k euro ? Is there any other way of pulling this whole thing off without a big financial dent or a super crazy risk ?
quote
Duncan
A much better strategy is to apply for a one-year MSc taught in in German at a university that has a one-year preparatory course leading to the DSH. It would be much cheaper and will give you an MSc year working mostly with Germans, and you'd have that whole second year to reduce your accent, improve your soft skills and so on. While most MSc degrees are four semesters, many are three with a final semester given over to writing the thesis, so some students start work at the end of the second semester.
A much better strategy is to apply for a one-year MSc taught in in German at a university that has a one-year preparatory course leading to the DSH. It would be much cheaper and will give you an MSc year working mostly with Germans, and you'd have that whole second year to reduce your accent, improve your soft skills and so on. While most MSc degrees are four semesters, many are three with a final semester given over to writing the thesis, so some students start work at the end of the second semester.
quote
laurie
That's a great suggestion from Duncan. It's worth noting that it will be very hard to get to professional fluency in one or two years if you're doing classes at the same time.
That's a great suggestion from Duncan. It's worth noting that it will be very hard to get to professional fluency in one or two years if you're doing classes at the same time.
quote
Duncan
Unless, of course, the classes are in German.
Unless, of course, the classes are in German.
quote
Raku
Thanks a lot @duncan and @laurie for your views and quick response. Well, the issue with this idea is that there is no surety that I will get an admit the next year after completing german language course. If there is any Msc in management programme which allows one year of german learning and assures a seat in the next year, that indeed will be the best option but, i didn't find any. Does these kind of programmes exist at all ?
Thanks a lot @duncan and @laurie for your views and quick response. Well, the issue with this idea is that there is no surety that I will get an admit the next year after completing german language course. If there is any Msc in management programme which allows one year of german learning and assures a seat in the next year, that indeed will be the best option but, i didn't find any. Does these kind of programmes exist at all ?
quote
Duncan
First, yes, it's very common to get conditional admittance, where you are admitted on the expectation that you first pass the DSH: https://www.google.co.uk/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#safe=off&q=site:.de+%22conditional+admission%22+DSH

If you think you can get admission to a programme taught in English, then admission to the German programmes is easier. There are more of them.
First, yes, it's very common to get conditional admittance, where you are admitted on the expectation that you first pass the DSH: https://www.google.co.uk/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#safe=off&q=site:.de+%22conditional+admission%22+DSH

If you think you can get admission to a programme taught in English, then admission to the German programmes is easier. There are more of them.
quote
RobPM
Duncan, Can you recommend any MIM from a good university in German?
Duncan, Can you recommend any MIM from a good university in German?
quote
Duncan
Sure. Of course in German it would not normally be called a MiM, but more often an MSc in BWL. Some state schools to consider are listed below.

Uni Augsburg
Katholische Universität - WFI / Ingolstadt
Uni Mainz
TU München
RWTH Aachen
Uni Mannheim
Sure. Of course in German it would not normally be called a MiM, but more often an MSc in BWL. Some state schools to consider are listed below.

Uni Augsburg
Katholische Universität - WFI / Ingolstadt
Uni Mainz
TU München
RWTH Aachen
Uni Mannheim
quote
Raku
If you think you can get admission to a programme taught in English, then admission to the German programmes is easier. There are more of them.


Thanks Duncan for the info. I will research more about this in the coming days for sure. For this year though, I have already applied for the MiM programmes in english track and woudn't want to lose on another year in India when I know I will have to restart from scratch in Germany again.

Another thing, @Duncan Is there a difference between MiM (masters in management), Msc in management and international business ? My understanding from my research about MiM, Msc. in management and MBA in Germany is (ignoring the language track for the programme):
1. MiM is also known as Msc in Management/ international business in some universities ( didn't find any university offering both MiM and international business).
2.MiM/Msc. In management differs from MBA in only some ways that are... 1. Mim is tution free for many state universities but MBA is never free. 2. Mim is for without work ex people whereas MBA needs min. 2 years workex.
3. For the same university offering MBA and Mim, expected gross compensation after degree is more (1.5 times around) for MBA compared to MiM graduates
4. In MBA any bachelors background is accepted but in Mim the universities may or may not have bachelor degree restrictions.
5. After MBA you join in mid level manager position, after Mim you join at entry level manager positions

Please correct me if I am wrong in any of the above conclusions.
[quote] If you think you can get admission to a programme taught in English, then admission to the German programmes is easier. There are more of them. [/quote]

Thanks Duncan for the info. I will research more about this in the coming days for sure. For this year though, I have already applied for the MiM programmes in english track and woudn't want to lose on another year in India when I know I will have to restart from scratch in Germany again.

Another thing, @Duncan Is there a difference between MiM (masters in management), Msc in management and international business ? My understanding from my research about MiM, Msc. in management and MBA in Germany is (ignoring the language track for the programme):
1. MiM is also known as Msc in Management/ international business in some universities ( didn't find any university offering both MiM and international business).
2.MiM/Msc. In management differs from MBA in only some ways that are... 1. Mim is tution free for many state universities but MBA is never free. 2. Mim is for without work ex people whereas MBA needs min. 2 years workex.
3. For the same university offering MBA and Mim, expected gross compensation after degree is more (1.5 times around) for MBA compared to MiM graduates
4. In MBA any bachelors background is accepted but in Mim the universities may or may not have bachelor degree restrictions.
5. After MBA you join in mid level manager position, after Mim you join at entry level manager positions

Please correct me if I am wrong in any of the above conclusions.
quote
Hello raku,
It would be great if you can guide me through getting admission in Germany for MBA.
Did you get any college??
Hello raku,
It would be great if you can guide me through getting admission in Germany for MBA.
Did you get any college??
quote

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