International students and working in the UK


Hi, I am interested in knowing the probability of getting a job in the UK with an MBA from the following schools:

Birmingham
Bath
Strathclyde
Durham
Leeds

Which one would be the best choice?

Hi, I am interested in knowing the probability of getting a job in the UK with an MBA from the following schools:

Birmingham
Bath
Strathclyde
Durham
Leeds

Which one would be the best choice?
quote

That's good to know, thanks for that. It's good to think about location and being close to potential employers.

That's good to know, thanks for that. It's good to think about location and being close to potential employers.
quote

Dear Adamco, yipkc and Duncan,
Is the situation much worrisome therein UK?especially for one who will be mostly on an education loan?
Adamco studied at Warwick (Warwick out of reach for me now since I couldn't crack gmat with a good score) while yipkc at Strath, so now which options to be considered for the best possible MBA for upcoming new batch (since I am conversant with only english language)?

Dear Adamco, yipkc and Duncan,
Is the situation much worrisome therein UK?especially for one who will be mostly on an education loan?
Adamco studied at Warwick (Warwick out of reach for me now since I couldn't crack gmat with a good score) while yipkc at Strath, so now which options to be considered for the best possible MBA for upcoming new batch (since I am conversant with only english language)?
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Duncan

The FT rankings are the best guide. Pay attention to the data for placement and international mobility.

The FT rankings are the best guide. Pay attention to the data for placement and international mobility.
quote

Sorry yipkc! you are at Birmingham, shownmichel at Strath and Adamco graduated from Warwick.

Sorry yipkc! you are at Birmingham, shownmichel at Strath and Adamco graduated from Warwick.
quote

Dear Duncan
Now that I have applied to The Bath MBA and University of Birmingham MBA (awaiting for results) and further considering the placement as well as employment data, should I apply to Leeds as one more option and not to Strath / Lancaster?

Dear Duncan
Now that I have applied to The Bath MBA and University of Birmingham MBA (awaiting for results) and further considering the placement as well as employment data, should I apply to Leeds as one more option and not to Strath / Lancaster?
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Duncan

Leeds is not better than the other schools you mention, but you know that. What are you really asking?

Leeds is not better than the other schools you mention, but you know that. What are you really asking?
quote

I have applied only to two schools as of now - Bath (98% employment) and Birmingham (94%). Apart from these, the FT employment data for Leeds show 100% while of Strath is 97% (but is known to have more Indians?)
If I want to apply for 2-3 more schools (like Lancaster... but FT shows 82% employment..my concern) before their deadlines end, which other schools should I consider?

I have applied only to two schools as of now - Bath (98% employment) and Birmingham (94%). Apart from these, the FT employment data for Leeds show 100% while of Strath is 97% (but is known to have more Indians?)
If I want to apply for 2-3 more schools (like Lancaster... but FT shows 82% employment..my concern) before their deadlines end, which other schools should I consider?
quote
Duncan

I think the rankings are your best guide. Look at last year's rankings too to get past annual variations.

I think the rankings are your best guide. Look at last year's rankings too to get past annual variations.
quote

Dear Duncan,
I tried but tough to select 2-3 more schools. How about Vlerick? Not sure about its MBA...but its Masters in General Management included in the FT Masters rankings 2014 (94%) and 2015 (97%). Cant choose EDHEC/Grenoble as not conversant with French nor EADA due to lack of Spanish..

Dear Duncan,
I tried but tough to select 2-3 more schools. How about Vlerick? Not sure about its MBA...but its Masters in General Management included in the FT Masters rankings 2014 (94%) and 2015 (97%). Cant choose EDHEC/Grenoble as not conversant with French nor EADA due to lack of Spanish..
quote
Duncan

If you are eligible for its MBA, I don't think any of the FT ranked schools will admit you to its MiM.

Take a look at this chart, which plots the FT data on careers against international mobility: https://www.dropbox.com/s/s95cpbd4az2l52r/FT%20Careers%20versus%20mobility.png?dl=0 I think you can make a few simple charts like this to help visualise the options. Also read Best schools for international students' placement http://www.find-mba.com/board/41143

Also, learning a language is less effort than getting an MBA. If a school is right then don't rule out learning the language first. I am also sure than many EDHEC and EADA students find work in other countries.

If you are eligible for its MBA, I don't think any of the FT ranked schools will admit you to its MiM.

Take a look at this chart, which plots the FT data on careers against international mobility: https://www.dropbox.com/s/s95cpbd4az2l52r/FT%20Careers%20versus%20mobility.png?dl=0 I think you can make a few simple charts like this to help visualise the options. Also read Best schools for international students' placement http://www.find-mba.com/board/41143

Also, learning a language is less effort than getting an MBA. If a school is right then don't rule out learning the language first. I am also sure than many EDHEC and EADA students find work in other countries.
quote

I live and work in London. I would suggest people don't come to UK for study. There is no post study work visa after masters course and it is quite difficult to find sponsorship. After masters you will get only 3 months to find sponsorship else go back to your home country. Think carefully before you come to UK.

I live and work in London. I would suggest people don't come to UK for study. There is no post study work visa after masters course and it is quite difficult to find sponsorship. After masters you will get only 3 months to find sponsorship else go back to your home country. Think carefully before you come to UK.
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Duncan

I think that's a little sweeping. It's worth looking at this post: Best schools for international students' placement http://www.find-mba.com/board/41143 That post names ten UK schools that are excellent at placing international students. At those best schools many students are able to find work: at worse schools, I am sure it's not often so easy.

I think that's a little sweeping. It's worth looking at this post: Best schools for international students' placement http://www.find-mba.com/board/41143 That post names ten UK schools that are excellent at placing international students. At those best schools many students are able to find work: at worse schools, I am sure it's not often so easy.

quote
Razors Edg...

I live and work in London. I would suggest people don't come to UK for study. There is no post study work visa after masters course and it is quite difficult to find sponsorship. After masters you will get only 3 months to find sponsorship else go back to your home country. Think carefully before you come to UK.

It's not that bad if you do your MBA at a top school.

Some good info here:
http://find-mba.com/articles/uk-visa-issues-staying-in-the-country-after-an-mba

[quote]I live and work in London. I would suggest people don't come to UK for study. There is no post study work visa after masters course and it is quite difficult to find sponsorship. After masters you will get only 3 months to find sponsorship else go back to your home country. Think carefully before you come to UK.[/quote]
It's not that bad if you do your MBA at a top school.

Some good info here:
http://find-mba.com/articles/uk-visa-issues-staying-in-the-country-after-an-mba
quote

Hi yipkc
Which were the business schools you had applied and shortlisted before finally choosing University for Birmingham for your MBA?

Hi Razors Edge
Eventually suppose an international candidate at a top UK school (51-100 FT rankings) doesn't gets placed by miniscule chance, the educational loan will be tough to pay off then.

Is the risk too riskier?

[Edited by mbaukmscfrance on Mar 01, 2016]

Hi yipkc
Which were the business schools you had applied and shortlisted before finally choosing University for Birmingham for your MBA?

Hi Razors Edge
Eventually suppose an international candidate at a top UK school (51-100 FT rankings) doesn't gets placed by miniscule chance, the educational loan will be tough to pay off then.

Is the risk too riskier?
quote
Inactive User

@mbaukmscfrance

Just my 2 cents

1) Don't blindly follow any ranking. FT does a good job comparing different MBA programs on certain parameters. However ask yourself, would you take this important decision of your life on the basis of rankings?
If I am not mistaken then HKUST, ISB, CEIBS, IE etc. are ranked higher. However each school needs to be evaluated in its own country.

Take a look at IE's career report.
http://www.ie.edu/business-school/degrees/international-mba/wp-content/uploads/Placement_Report_IMBA_2015.pdf

See Page # 12 & 13 for their Mobility (post graduation employment). 62% students from Asia found employment in Asia. 11% in EU, 13% in Middle East, while 8% of student from Asia found jobs in North America.

If you have a target company, position, and industry in mind then navigating and determining your career outcome becomes easier. Think about what specific skill sets you bring to the table that will help companies fill their skill gap.

Rankings doesn't mean squat in real life. College of William and Mary is absent from several rankings, but recruiters in East Coast of US are aware of this school - Deloitte comes to W&M MBA to hire Federal Consulting - Human Capital. On the other hand no one in India knows about this school. Likewise ISB may be top 30 in FT above Cornell, but would that mean a recruiter from Goldman Sachs somehow prefer an ISB grad over Cornell grad for a position in NY ?

You don't approach a recruiter for a job saying "Hey, I did my MBA from a school that's listed in top 20 at FT.com, so give me a job" I don't think it works that way. A better approach might be to evaluate what skills you have. What skills and life experiences can your target business school provide you. Will the combination of your previous work experience and hence the skills developed along with the skills acquired in business school be sufficient and prepare you for your post MBA job at your target organization?

In US you would be better off doing your MBA from FT #88 Smeal (Penn State) than HKUST, Recruiters are not going to crazily track FT.com for changes in Rankings. I mean do you think companies care if McCombs is ranked FT #30 or FT #48?

My personal opinion is that we wouldn't be doing justice if we compare Boston University with Durham. I think Rankings were designed to make decision easier for students, however they have now become a propaganda / marketing tool (nothing wrong with it). I would advice not to look too much into it because once you join a school you'll realize that no one does.

Good luck!

Hi yipkc
Which were the business schools you had applied and shortlisted before finally choosing University for Birmingham for your MBA?

Hi Razors Edge
Eventually suppose an international candidate at a top UK school (51-100 FT rankings) doesn't gets placed by miniscule chance, the educational loan will be tough to pay off then.

Is the risk too riskier?

@mbaukmscfrance

Just my 2 cents

1) Don't blindly follow any ranking. FT does a good job comparing different MBA programs on certain parameters. However ask yourself, would you take this important decision of your life on the basis of rankings?
If I am not mistaken then HKUST, ISB, CEIBS, IE etc. are ranked higher. However each school needs to be evaluated in its own country.

Take a look at IE's career report.
http://www.ie.edu/business-school/degrees/international-mba/wp-content/uploads/Placement_Report_IMBA_2015.pdf

See Page # 12 & 13 for their Mobility (post graduation employment). 62% students from Asia found employment in Asia. 11% in EU, 13% in Middle East, while 8% of student from Asia found jobs in North America.

If you have a target company, position, and industry in mind then navigating and determining your career outcome becomes easier. Think about what specific skill sets you bring to the table that will help companies fill their skill gap.

Rankings doesn't mean squat in real life. College of William and Mary is absent from several rankings, but recruiters in East Coast of US are aware of this school - Deloitte comes to W&M MBA to hire Federal Consulting - Human Capital. On the other hand no one in India knows about this school. Likewise ISB may be top 30 in FT above Cornell, but would that mean a recruiter from Goldman Sachs somehow prefer an ISB grad over Cornell grad for a position in NY ?

You don't approach a recruiter for a job saying "Hey, I did my MBA from a school that's listed in top 20 at FT.com, so give me a job" I don't think it works that way. A better approach might be to evaluate what skills you have. What skills and life experiences can your target business school provide you. Will the combination of your previous work experience and hence the skills developed along with the skills acquired in business school be sufficient and prepare you for your post MBA job at your target organization?

In US you would be better off doing your MBA from FT #88 Smeal (Penn State) than HKUST, Recruiters are not going to crazily track FT.com for changes in Rankings. I mean do you think companies care if McCombs is ranked FT #30 or FT #48?

My personal opinion is that we wouldn't be doing justice if we compare Boston University with Durham. I think Rankings were designed to make decision easier for students, however they have now become a propaganda / marketing tool (nothing wrong with it). I would advice not to look too much into it because once you join a school you'll realize that no one does.

Good luck!
[quote]Hi yipkc
Which were the business schools you had applied and shortlisted before finally choosing University for Birmingham for your MBA?

Hi Razors Edge
Eventually suppose an international candidate at a top UK school (51-100 FT rankings) doesn't gets placed by miniscule chance, the educational loan will be tough to pay off then.

Is the risk too riskier?
[/quote]
quote
yipkc

W&M MBA appeared on FT ranking a couple of years ago but it has lost its sparks in recent years. It is still important to follow the ranking but make sure you look at its past records in the ranking tables. Those which consistently appear on the ranking table means that it is a quality school providing a quality programme, i.e. LBS to Lancaster.

W&M MBA appeared on FT ranking a couple of years ago but it has lost its sparks in recent years. It is still important to follow the ranking but make sure you look at its past records in the ranking tables. Those which consistently appear on the ranking table means that it is a quality school providing a quality programme, i.e. LBS to Lancaster.
quote
Duncan

With small programs like W&M it can be data insufficiency rather than poor outcomes that keeps them out of rankings.

With small programs like W&M it can be data insufficiency rather than poor outcomes that keeps them out of rankings.
quote
Inactive User

@yipkc,

The main point is that rankings are there to help students make an informed decision. However beyond that rankings don't solve a purpose for students. Rankings however solve a purpose for school's admission team - to be used in advertising. I used W&M just as an example to illustrate my point.

I think it will benefit students more if they think about skill development, and skill improvements to fill the skill gaps companies have. Recruiter are not going to care much if XYZ Business school came #40 or #68 in FT or BusinessWeek or any other rankings.

I would partially agree that constant appearance of a school in any rankings is a good indicator. However If you think that consistently appearance on the ranking table means that it is a quality school providing a quality program then shouldn't - by extension of the same logic - HKUST, CEIBS have a higher quality program than Cornell? Should a more relevant question students should be asking is "What skill sets and life experiences can HKUST provide me that will help me achieve my career goals vis-a-vis Cornell" ?

I think this where student's make a mistake of comparing programs and reading rankings too closely and feeling positive (or negative) if their target school moves 10 places up or down.

Good luck for your MBA journey!

W&M MBA appeared on FT ranking a couple of years ago but it has lost its sparks in recent years. It is still important to follow the ranking but make sure you look at its past records in the ranking tables. Those which consistently appear on the ranking table means that it is a quality school providing a quality programme, i.e. LBS to Lancaster.

@yipkc,

The main point is that rankings are there to help students make an informed decision. However beyond that rankings don't solve a purpose for students. Rankings however solve a purpose for school's admission team - to be used in advertising. I used W&M just as an example to illustrate my point.

I think it will benefit students more if they think about skill development, and skill improvements to fill the skill gaps companies have. Recruiter are not going to care much if XYZ Business school came #40 or #68 in FT or BusinessWeek or any other rankings.

I would partially agree that constant appearance of a school in any rankings is a good indicator. However If you think that consistently appearance on the ranking table means that it is a quality school providing a quality program then shouldn't - by extension of the same logic - HKUST, CEIBS have a higher quality program than Cornell? Should a more relevant question students should be asking is "What skill sets and life experiences can HKUST provide me that will help me achieve my career goals vis-a-vis Cornell" ?

I think this where student's make a mistake of comparing programs and reading rankings too closely and feeling positive (or negative) if their target school moves 10 places up or down.

Good luck for your MBA journey!

[quote]W&M MBA appeared on FT ranking a couple of years ago but it has lost its sparks in recent years. It is still important to follow the ranking but make sure you look at its past records in the ranking tables. Those which consistently appear on the ranking table means that it is a quality school providing a quality programme, i.e. LBS to Lancaster. [/quote]
quote
mba hipste...


I think this where student's make a mistake of comparing programs and reading rankings too closely and feeling positive (or negative) if their target school moves 10 places up or down.

That's a great point. Rankings are great, especially the FT's - because they use objective metrics to compare very different programs. But there are a couple of glaring issues with them too - not the least of which is that they can be a bit off-balance due to purchasing parity power issues. Plus, the main rankings tend to feature schools that do well in placing grads in high-salary fields like financial services and consulting.

So if you don't plan on working in those fields, or you want to work in a country where PPP works against you - then it's really hard to rely completely on the rankings. They certainly shouldn't be the only thing you use in your decision-making process.

[quote]
I think this where student's make a mistake of comparing programs and reading rankings too closely and feeling positive (or negative) if their target school moves 10 places up or down.[/quote]
That's a great point. Rankings are great, especially the FT's - because they use objective metrics to compare very different programs. But there are a couple of glaring issues with them too - not the least of which is that they can be a bit off-balance due to purchasing parity power issues. Plus, the main rankings tend to feature schools that do well in placing grads in high-salary fields like financial services and consulting.

So if you don't plan on working in those fields, or you want to work in a country where PPP works against you - then it's really hard to rely completely on the rankings. They certainly shouldn't be the only thing you use in your decision-making process.
quote

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