CEIBS Top Chinese Business School?


ralph
Seems like the Chinese edition of Forbes just released its rankings of Chinese business schools. Apparently CEIBS tops the lists for full-time programs and overall value, probably because grads from that school make more overall than grads from other schools.

Guanghua School of Management had the best value for a part-time program, and Cheung Kong Graduate School of Business had the best EMBA program.

Is there anybody in China who has access to the magazine and can post the complete rankings?
Seems like the Chinese edition of Forbes just released its rankings of Chinese business schools. Apparently CEIBS tops the lists for full-time programs and overall value, probably because grads from that school make more overall than grads from other schools.

Guanghua School of Management had the best value for a part-time program, and Cheung Kong Graduate School of Business had the best EMBA program.

Is there anybody in China who has access to the magazine and can post the complete rankings?
quote
AoZaoMian
1) Ceibs, Shanghai
2) Beida BIMBA Beijing
3) Tsinghua/MIT, Beijing
4) Beida Guanghua, Beijing
5) Cheung Kong, Shanghai/BJ
6) Fudan/MIT, Shanghai
7) Jiaotong, Shanghai
8) Zhongshan/MIT, Guangzhou
9) Xiamen University, Xiamen
10) Nankai, Tianjin
11) Zhejiang University, Hangzhou
12) Nanjing University, Nanjing
13) Renmin University, Beijing
14) Shanghai Finance University, Shanghai
15) Foreign Trade University, Beijing

The article also has salary info - but take those with a grain of salt since many get inflated due to foreign students returning to their jobs overseas (especially in Korea and Japan).
1) Ceibs, Shanghai
2) Beida BIMBA Beijing
3) Tsinghua/MIT, Beijing
4) Beida Guanghua, Beijing
5) Cheung Kong, Shanghai/BJ
6) Fudan/MIT, Shanghai
7) Jiaotong, Shanghai
8) Zhongshan/MIT, Guangzhou
9) Xiamen University, Xiamen
10) Nankai, Tianjin
11) Zhejiang University, Hangzhou
12) Nanjing University, Nanjing
13) Renmin University, Beijing
14) Shanghai Finance University, Shanghai
15) Foreign Trade University, Beijing

The article also has salary info - but take those with a grain of salt since many get inflated due to foreign students returning to their jobs overseas (especially in Korea and Japan).
quote
Clam
Interesting how BiMBA is higher than Guanghua despite rumors that its less rigorous than Guanghua. I guess the heavy international focus must be giving it some advantage.

Does anyone have any opinion on how Fudan will do in the future compared to CEIBS? Will they rise in the rankings? Fudan has a much longer history than most schools, and their general reputation is essentially unrivalled in Shanghai (Tsinghua and Beida are probably the only ones that stand a chance, but I feel Shanghainese may hold Fudan higher due to hometown bias). Does anyone think this general reputation would be very beneficial for finding work with a Chinese firm? Obviously CEIBS has the benefit in regards to international firms, but what about local Shanghai companies? Local companies are growing fast, and it might be wiser to get in while its still hot.

Interesting how BiMBA is higher than Guanghua despite rumors that its less rigorous than Guanghua. I guess the heavy international focus must be giving it some advantage.

Does anyone have any opinion on how Fudan will do in the future compared to CEIBS? Will they rise in the rankings? Fudan has a much longer history than most schools, and their general reputation is essentially unrivalled in Shanghai (Tsinghua and Beida are probably the only ones that stand a chance, but I feel Shanghainese may hold Fudan higher due to hometown bias). Does anyone think this general reputation would be very beneficial for finding work with a Chinese firm? Obviously CEIBS has the benefit in regards to international firms, but what about local Shanghai companies? Local companies are growing fast, and it might be wiser to get in while its still hot.
quote
ralph

Interesting how BiMBA is higher than Guanghua despite rumors that its less rigorous than Guanghua. I guess the heavy international focus must be giving it some advantage.


I agree, that came out of nowhere.

Does anyone have any opinion on how Fudan will do in the future compared to CEIBS?


I think CEIBS will continue to outrank Fudan, especially among international rankings like FT. More and more, for international firms, banking, and investment opportunities, Beijing is looking like the place to be. CEIBS saw this and now has a campus there. I doubt very highly that Fudan will jump into the Beijing arena, because it's stuck in the old Chinese paradigm of isolationism. Not that I think it's a bad school - not at all - but in terms of a future international China, it will not be able to compete.
<blockquote>
Interesting how BiMBA is higher than Guanghua despite rumors that its less rigorous than Guanghua. I guess the heavy international focus must be giving it some advantage.
</blockquote>

I agree, that came out of nowhere.

<blockquote>Does anyone have any opinion on how Fudan will do in the future compared to CEIBS? </blockquote>

I think CEIBS will continue to outrank Fudan, especially among international rankings like FT. More and more, for international firms, banking, and investment opportunities, Beijing is looking like the place to be. CEIBS saw this and now has a campus there. I doubt very highly that Fudan will jump into the Beijing arena, because it's stuck in the old Chinese paradigm of isolationism. Not that I think it's a bad school - not at all - but in terms of a future international China, it will not be able to compete.
quote
Magnet
Does anyone have an opinion on SAIF aka the business faculty of Shanghai Jiao Tong University. They offer an international MBA course in English and they're based in Shanghai. From the stories that I've read about the job placements their students in places like UBS, Merrill Lynch, JP Hong Kong, Bank of America, I'm pretty impressed - do all Chinese uni's get such great placements for their students.
Does anyone have an opinion on SAIF aka the business faculty of Shanghai Jiao Tong University. They offer an international MBA course in English and they're based in Shanghai. From the stories that I've read about the job placements their students in places like UBS, Merrill Lynch, JP Hong Kong, Bank of America, I'm pretty impressed - do all Chinese uni's get such great placements for their students.
quote
wangtao
Most of those companies have strong operations in Hong Kong but not in mainland China. Regardless, most of those hires are probably for locals and not foreigners. 2 questions - do the MBA candidates of the program graduate from Shanghai and go to HK? Do they get accepted to the global associate/MBA program or are they hired as local hires (often in areas such as human resources). There are still a lot of unanswered questions for career prospects in doing an MBA in China - people are having success - but there is no guaranteed success/salary/prestige. You have to create your own path and hope you pick up and speak fluent Chinese along the way.
Most of those companies have strong operations in Hong Kong but not in mainland China. Regardless, most of those hires are probably for locals and not foreigners. 2 questions - do the MBA candidates of the program graduate from Shanghai and go to HK? Do they get accepted to the global associate/MBA program or are they hired as local hires (often in areas such as human resources). There are still a lot of unanswered questions for career prospects in doing an MBA in China - people are having success - but there is no guaranteed success/salary/prestige. You have to create your own path and hope you pick up and speak fluent Chinese along the way.
quote
Magnet
I guess if you study there and learn about chinese business...then what you could do is go back to your home country and find a company that needs people to go over and work in China? Most big companies send staff over to China right? Certainly the big consultancy companies and most banks?
I guess if you study there and learn about chinese business...then what you could do is go back to your home country and find a company that needs people to go over and work in China? Most big companies send staff over to China right? Certainly the big consultancy companies and most banks?
quote
myellen
1) Ceibs, Shanghai
2) Beida BIMBA Beijing
3) Tsinghua/MIT, Beijing
4) Beida Guanghua, Beijing
5) Cheung Kong, Shanghai/BJ
6) Fudan/MIT, Shanghai
7) Jiaotong, Shanghai
8) Zhongshan/MIT, Guangzhou
9) Xiamen University, Xiamen
10) Nankai, Tianjin
11) Zhejiang University, Hangzhou
12) Nanjing University, Nanjing
13) Renmin University, Beijing
14) Shanghai Finance University, Shanghai
15) Foreign Trade University, Beijing

The article also has salary info - but take those with a grain of salt since many get inflated due to foreign students returning to their jobs overseas (especially in Korea and Japan).

Hi, Does anyone have information about Cheung Kong MBA? In the list, supposed to be better than Fudan MBA, how accurate is the data? Thanks
<blockquote>1) Ceibs, Shanghai
2) Beida BIMBA Beijing
3) Tsinghua/MIT, Beijing
4) Beida Guanghua, Beijing
5) Cheung Kong, Shanghai/BJ
6) Fudan/MIT, Shanghai
7) Jiaotong, Shanghai
8) Zhongshan/MIT, Guangzhou
9) Xiamen University, Xiamen
10) Nankai, Tianjin
11) Zhejiang University, Hangzhou
12) Nanjing University, Nanjing
13) Renmin University, Beijing
14) Shanghai Finance University, Shanghai
15) Foreign Trade University, Beijing

The article also has salary info - but take those with a grain of salt since many get inflated due to foreign students returning to their jobs overseas (especially in Korea and Japan). </blockquote>
Hi, Does anyone have information about Cheung Kong MBA? In the list, supposed to be better than Fudan MBA, how accurate is the data? Thanks
quote
ralph
I think they're pretty comparable academically. For international legitimacy, you can look at it in terms of their partnerships, Cheung Kong has partnered with Columbia, INSEAD, and Darden - and while Fudan's main partner is MIT, it also has arrangements with Olin, and ESSEC, among others.

I think the main decision will come down to where you'd like to study: Beijing or Shanghai. CKGSB's program is solely in Beijing (they have a campus in Shanghai, but that's only for EMBA students,) while Fudan is based in Shanghai.

It's important to think about this, especially if you plan on doing business in China - because your networking is going to play a significant role in your prospects after graduation.
I think they're pretty comparable academically. For international legitimacy, you can look at it in terms of their partnerships, Cheung Kong has partnered with Columbia, INSEAD, and Darden - and while Fudan's main partner is MIT, it also has arrangements with Olin, and ESSEC, among others.

I think the main decision will come down to where you'd like to study: Beijing or Shanghai. CKGSB's program is solely in Beijing (they have a campus in Shanghai, but that's only for EMBA students,) while Fudan is based in Shanghai.

It's important to think about this, especially if you plan on doing business in China - because your networking is going to play a significant role in your prospects after graduation.
quote
AoZaoMian
If you are non-chinese, following graduation, the choice is pretty clear. Work for a non-chinese company with a non-chinese (or ABC) boss, and hope in 2-5 years you get promoted outside of China - if not HK or Singapore. Working for a Chinese boss in a Chinese company is a great internship, but not a good career choice (Chinese will treat you as a toy or experiment). Most of these "foreign boss" jobs are in Shanghai, since most Asia Pacific HQ are in Shanghai. But, the problem of living in Shanghai is that learning Chinese is 50% as effective as Beijing. If you can read the newspaper and emails, and listen to conference calls and meetings conducted in Chinese, you can get by in Shanghai. If you are starting from beginner level, you can only achieve this level in Beijing or another nothern city (Harbin, Tianjin, Dalian). But the problem is, once you get this job in Shanghai (or Beijing), you will never be promoted to Vice President or President of a company. The best is VP of Investment Relations (if the company is US/Europe) listed, or if the company is 50% export related to Europe/US (think high tech industries like renewable energy or outsourcing), you can do business development. Aside from these niche jobs, if you are not of Chinese ethnicity - as a previous poster mentioned - get the 3-5 years of experience in China, say you can understand a conference call and read documents, then go to your home country and start the process to accend to VP. It is not ideal, but you put your "China time" in to let you be selected over your other colleagues who have only been to the Great Wall.

Which school? It really does not matter. It is all about getting your Chinese up to the listening to conference calls, meetings, and reading documents level. Since Cheung Kong is only 1 year, good luck! BEIDA or Tsinghua are the logical choices. The thing that does matter is the alumni you graduate from - they will not help you now, but in 10-20 years, they will be gold (especially when your classmate, head of VP for some Chinese company, just bought a $500 million US company and needs to reorganize the US staff).
If you are non-chinese, following graduation, the choice is pretty clear. Work for a non-chinese company with a non-chinese (or ABC) boss, and hope in 2-5 years you get promoted outside of China - if not HK or Singapore. Working for a Chinese boss in a Chinese company is a great internship, but not a good career choice (Chinese will treat you as a toy or experiment). Most of these "foreign boss" jobs are in Shanghai, since most Asia Pacific HQ are in Shanghai. But, the problem of living in Shanghai is that learning Chinese is 50% as effective as Beijing. If you can read the newspaper and emails, and listen to conference calls and meetings conducted in Chinese, you can get by in Shanghai. If you are starting from beginner level, you can only achieve this level in Beijing or another nothern city (Harbin, Tianjin, Dalian). But the problem is, once you get this job in Shanghai (or Beijing), you will never be promoted to Vice President or President of a company. The best is VP of Investment Relations (if the company is US/Europe) listed, or if the company is 50% export related to Europe/US (think high tech industries like renewable energy or outsourcing), you can do business development. Aside from these niche jobs, if you are not of Chinese ethnicity - as a previous poster mentioned - get the 3-5 years of experience in China, say you can understand a conference call and read documents, then go to your home country and start the process to accend to VP. It is not ideal, but you put your "China time" in to let you be selected over your other colleagues who have only been to the Great Wall.

Which school? It really does not matter. It is all about getting your Chinese up to the listening to conference calls, meetings, and reading documents level. Since Cheung Kong is only 1 year, good luck! BEIDA or Tsinghua are the logical choices. The thing that does matter is the alumni you graduate from - they will not help you now, but in 10-20 years, they will be gold (especially when your classmate, head of VP for some Chinese company, just bought a $500 million US company and needs to reorganize the US staff).

quote
Eddie
Dear all!!!

Whats the difference between BIMBA and Guanghua School of Management? I already realized that are two different programs!!! But I didn't understand if it is the same University? Does anybody can help me with this information??
Dear all!!!

Whats the difference between BIMBA and Guanghua School of Management? I already realized that are two different programs!!! But I didn't understand if it is the same University? Does anybody can help me with this information??
quote
Dear all!!!

Whats the difference between BIMBA and Guanghua School of Management? I already realized that are two different programs!!! But I didn't understand if it is the same University? Does anybody can help me with this information??


The same university-peking university, different schools.

1 BiMBA starts in 1998 with its internationl MBA programs, both full-time and part-time. Guanghua is famous for its local mba programs because it recruits a lot of Chinese MBA. It starts its imba in 2000, only full time. In other words, BiMBA is born for Peking University's internationl MBA programs strategy, though guanghua is the management school of Peking Uni.. Guanghua focuses on PKU's local programs.

2 BiMBA is a joint program between Pku and schools in the States and Europe. At the very first beginning, it's the fruit of US president Clinton's visit to China in 1998. They started a coorperation in education industry--international mba, which is very new in China. So more than 70% of BiMBA's faculty come from business schools in the States and Europe.That's to say, they are from a well-grown market and kown well the standards and international practices. Guanghua also has great faculty, but not for the international students.

3 BiMBA grants mba degrees from Vlerick Leuven Gent Management School and certificates from pku, because it's a joint program. Guanghua grants Pku's degrees.

4 The two schools have very diffenent locations on Pku campus. Personally I prefer BiMBA's yard.

Is this enough? I did a lot of research before I made my decision.
<blockquote>Dear all!!!

Whats the difference between BIMBA and Guanghua School of Management? I already realized that are two different programs!!! But I didn't understand if it is the same University? Does anybody can help me with this information??</blockquote>

The same university-peking university, different schools.

1 BiMBA starts in 1998 with its internationl MBA programs, both full-time and part-time. Guanghua is famous for its local mba programs because it recruits a lot of Chinese MBA. It starts its imba in 2000, only full time. In other words, BiMBA is born for Peking University's internationl MBA programs strategy, though guanghua is the management school of Peking Uni.. Guanghua focuses on PKU's local programs.

2 BiMBA is a joint program between Pku and schools in the States and Europe. At the very first beginning, it's the fruit of US president Clinton's visit to China in 1998. They started a coorperation in education industry--international mba, which is very new in China. So more than 70% of BiMBA's faculty come from business schools in the States and Europe.That's to say, they are from a well-grown market and kown well the standards and international practices. Guanghua also has great faculty, but not for the international students.

3 BiMBA grants mba degrees from Vlerick Leuven Gent Management School and certificates from pku, because it's a joint program. Guanghua grants Pku's degrees.

4 The two schools have very diffenent locations on Pku campus. Personally I prefer BiMBA's yard.

Is this enough? I did a lot of research before I made my decision.
quote
Eddie
Marymamama,

Tks for the information, very enlightening!!!

See u soon!!!
Marymamama,

Tks for the information, very enlightening!!!

See u soon!!!
quote
calix
does BiMBA really provide Beida's certificates? I dont see this at its website.
does BiMBA really provide Beida's certificates? I dont see this at its website.
quote
http://en2009.bimba.edu.cn/article.asp?articleid=4526

pics of degree and certificates
http://en2009.bimba.edu.cn/article.asp?articleid=4526

pics of degree and certificates
quote
calix
http://en2009.bimba.edu.cn/article.asp?articleid=4526

pics of degree and certificates


roger that! Vlerick's degree+Beida's certificates, seems perfect.

many thanks!
<blockquote>http://en2009.bimba.edu.cn/article.asp?articleid=4526

pics of degree and certificates</blockquote>

roger that! Vlerick's degree+Beida's certificates, seems perfect.

many thanks!
quote
Guanghua v. Bimba is a no brainer.

Bimba is not a real Peking University degree. You get a degree from some school in Belgium. The faculty all fly in. Guanghua is accredited, has 135 faculty, mostly with international PhDs and is half the cost. Yes, it is tougher to get in.

If you are willing to pay twice the price for half the quality, then you really should ask whether you have the right stuff for business school.
Guanghua v. Bimba is a no brainer.

Bimba is not a real Peking University degree. You get a degree from some school in Belgium. The faculty all fly in. Guanghua is accredited, has 135 faculty, mostly with international PhDs and is half the cost. Yes, it is tougher to get in.

If you are willing to pay twice the price for half the quality, then you really should ask whether you have the right stuff for business school.
quote
Duncan
I do agree that GuangHua is stronger, but what you say sounds inaccurate. Bimba leads to MBA certificates from both Peking University and Vlerick. Vlerick isn't just "some school": it's a triple accredited MBA in the FT top 100 awarded by Europe's richest business school. Around 20% of the Bimba faculty are local, and the international faculty come from top schools which are at the least at the level of the local faculty.

Bimba isn't twice the cost of GuangHua. GuangHua costs RMB188,000, while Bimba is RMB265,000. So, GuangHua is 29% cheaper.
I do agree that GuangHua is stronger, but what you say sounds inaccurate. Bimba leads to MBA certificates from both Peking University and Vlerick. Vlerick isn't just "some school": it's a triple accredited MBA in the FT top 100 awarded by Europe's richest business school. Around 20% of the Bimba faculty are local, and the international faculty come from top schools which are at the least at the level of the local faculty.

Bimba isn't twice the cost of GuangHua. GuangHua costs RMB188,000, while Bimba is RMB265,000. So, GuangHua is 29% cheaper.
quote
ralph
Guanghua is probably the stronger school within China, but I wouldn't discount the BiMBA program, with its connections to Vlerick and its solid position in the Chinese MBA rankings. Speaking of which - just a quick update to my original post - here are the top 7 programs in the most recent (2012) Forbes' China rankings, which gauges the business schools primarily based on value and ROI:

1. CEIBS
2. BiMBA (Peking)
3. Guanghua (Peking)
4. Tsinghua
5. Cheung Kong
6. Fudan
7. Anti (Shanghai Jiao Tong)
Guanghua is probably the stronger school within China, but I wouldn't discount the BiMBA program, with its connections to Vlerick and its solid position in the Chinese MBA rankings. Speaking of which - just a quick update to my original post - here are the top 7 programs in the most recent (2012) Forbes' China rankings, which gauges the business schools primarily based on value and ROI:

1. CEIBS
2. BiMBA (Peking)
3. Guanghua (Peking)
4. Tsinghua
5. Cheung Kong
6. Fudan
7. Anti (Shanghai Jiao Tong)
quote
loopy1
As someone who was part of the Tsinghua-MIT IMBA program I can tell you through first hand experience that the overall program leaves a lot to be desired.

Although it is often ranked as one of the best universities in China, and the relationship with MIT Sloan is highly publicized by the school, I was quite surprised at how badly run the IMBA program is.

There are definitely some quality local and international students that you will get to meet in the program, but the number of students that would typically be unqualified for a typical Western MBA is astonishing. A number of students are in their early 20's with little, to no work experience. Also, some students are admitted purely based off family background, despite the fact that they are clearly not capable MBA candidates.

As for the MBA program staff, they do genuinely try to help students, however it is so unorganized and under resourced that they are heavily reliant on students themselves to come up with ideas and put in the effort to run the program. The processes and policies are not consistent, and there is strong favoritism that goes on to particular individuals, depending on their background.

Which brings me to my final point regarding the teaching staff. From time to time you will get some visiting professors from MIT running one day lectures, and there may also be some foreign professors who teach certain courses, however the majority of your courses are taught by local Chinese lecturers. The local Chinese professors are usually quite bad in that they often times have poor English proficiency (at least not enough to be able to teach a core MBA course), have no practical experience or real-world experience whatsoever, and are stuck in the traditional Chinese way of teaching which is so narrow minded and unwilling to consider outside viewpoints.

I know that this may appear to be a bit of a rant about the Tsinghua IMBA program, and is quite negative. I just want to give you all a real representation of the program from the point-of-view of someone who has gone through it. I really do hope that the school and the program office can get their act together, to make it the great program that it could be, however I don't see this coming anytime soon.

Going to Tsinghua will give you a good chance to experience China and understand the challenges, however do not go there expecting to get a professional quality MBA experience and education.
As someone who was part of the Tsinghua-MIT IMBA program I can tell you through first hand experience that the overall program leaves a lot to be desired.

Although it is often ranked as one of the best universities in China, and the relationship with MIT Sloan is highly publicized by the school, I was quite surprised at how badly run the IMBA program is.

There are definitely some quality local and international students that you will get to meet in the program, but the number of students that would typically be unqualified for a typical Western MBA is astonishing. A number of students are in their early 20's with little, to no work experience. Also, some students are admitted purely based off family background, despite the fact that they are clearly not capable MBA candidates.

As for the MBA program staff, they do genuinely try to help students, however it is so unorganized and under resourced that they are heavily reliant on students themselves to come up with ideas and put in the effort to run the program. The processes and policies are not consistent, and there is strong favoritism that goes on to particular individuals, depending on their background.

Which brings me to my final point regarding the teaching staff. From time to time you will get some visiting professors from MIT running one day lectures, and there may also be some foreign professors who teach certain courses, however the majority of your courses are taught by local Chinese lecturers. The local Chinese professors are usually quite bad in that they often times have poor English proficiency (at least not enough to be able to teach a core MBA course), have no practical experience or real-world experience whatsoever, and are stuck in the traditional Chinese way of teaching which is so narrow minded and unwilling to consider outside viewpoints.

I know that this may appear to be a bit of a rant about the Tsinghua IMBA program, and is quite negative. I just want to give you all a real representation of the program from the point-of-view of someone who has gone through it. I really do hope that the school and the program office can get their act together, to make it the great program that it could be, however I don't see this coming anytime soon.

Going to Tsinghua will give you a good chance to experience China and understand the challenges, however do not go there expecting to get a professional quality MBA experience and education.
quote

Reply to Post

Related Business Schools

Beijing, China 1 Follower 2 Discussions
Beijing, China 11 Followers 36 Discussions
Nanjing, China 4 Followers 1 Discussion
Beijing, China 6 Followers 12 Discussions
Beijing, China 8 Followers 49 Discussions
Beijing, China 9 Followers 63 Discussions
Zhejiang, China 4 Followers 4 Discussions
Tianjin, China 1 Follower 1 Discussion
Beijing, China 6 Followers 100 Discussions
Shanghai, China 33 Followers 78 Discussions
Shanghai, China 26 Followers 36 Discussions
Guangzhou, China 7 Followers 8 Discussions

Related Articles

Western Business Schools Find Promise in China’s MBA Market

May 06, 2015

There are a growing number of joint MBAs offered in China. But western business schools entering the market there face challenges.

MBA Programs in Emerging Markets: China and Hong Kong

Jan 18, 2010

Incredible growth is attracting international students to MBA programs in China

More Articles

Hot Discussions