Hi group,

Could somebody share some information on the IE business schools Master in management course. I know IE's MBA is ranked very high, what about the MIM courses??

Appreciated the help
Anuj

Hi there,
IE is a very good brand, it's great to hold an IE degree. I personally can't help you with the MIM, since I completely focussed on MBA in my research. But maybe other people on this board - even though this a forum dedicated specifically to MBAs.

May I ask you why you want to do a MIM and not an MBA? The MIM must be quite expensive also, almost like an MBA, I would advise you to do the latter, better standing...

Hi katalina, thanks for the response. I agree to your point that MBA from IE is a very good bet, though i wanted to understand the difference between these two courses. On reading through the details on the site, it looked quite similar.
MIM had different focus areas for which IE has developed 4-5 specialized MIM courses. Similarly in the MBA we would be choosing the focus areas, so whats the difference between these two courses.
IE's MBA is ranked very high, though not sure how the MIM programs are ranked. My thought behind this was if the course structures are not very different, then gettin into IE was all that I cared.
Thanks for your thoughts, keep in touch
Anuj

Hello Anuj,

In Europe, the main difference between MBAs and Masters in Management is work experience (MBAs require work experience, MIMs don't). Curricula are not really different.

The reasons why business schools offer those two types of degrees are easy to understand. Curricula are very similar, so the same faculty can be used for both degrees. Schools receive applications from people with little or no work experience and cannot accept those applications for the MBA programs, but can accept them for the MIMs. One important reason why those applications are not accepted for the MBA programs is that schools could lose their accreditation if they did so. By offering a pre-experience degree, schools manage to earn some revenue whithout hurting their MBA degrees (which have tighter accreditation requirements and are the main source of reputation).

I would try to make sure that the MIM is not a second-class degree within IE. Try to compare the faculty, check the admission requirements, and make sure that the selection process is serious.

Hi Jaitego, I read your comment with a lot of interest.
As you can read in my post above, I did not really understand the point of doing a MIM in an expensive school, since the tuition for that program is unsually almost the same as for MBA (in the same b school). I understand very well the difference between the two degrees, but why pay almost as much money as for a MBA?

Holding an MBA form IE you can for instance expect a certain salary. Is that the case for the MIM also?

I'm sure am MIM from IE looks good on your CV and gives it an extra value. But I would better do the MIM at the University and keep that money for my MBA.

Or did I miss something? Or misunderstand? I would appreciate your ideas, thanks.
Kata

Katalina, I think I basically agree with you. Maybe my last post was a bit confusing.

When the pre-experience degree is almost as expensive as the MBA, then I think it is definitely better to do the MBA. When I said that the main difference between an MBA and a Master in Management was work experience, I didn't mean to say that it was a small difference. The fact that students in an MBA class have much more work experience is very important because you tend to learn a lot from your classmates. The questions that other people ask in class, the comments other people make, what you learn through teamwork --all that is quite different depending on work experience.

Having said that, I think a pre-experience degree might be worthwhile in some cases. For example, if someone has just graduated from college with a non-business degree, is interested in a corporate job, but is currently unemployed, enrolling in a Master in Management might be a good way to improve employability. I just wouldn't recommend a pre-experience degree to someone who has already some work experience, particularly if the degree is expensive. In those cases I think an MBA is more appropriate.

If you were to compare the rate of return of a Master in Management and an MBA, I don't know how it would be. The FT ranking provides average salaries for both MBAs and MIMs. For MIMs, average salaries go from ?30,000 to ?60,000 (roughly speaking), whereas for MBAs average salaries go from ?58,000 to ?115,000 approximately. But you should take into account that the student bodies are quite different. We would have to know the pre-degree salaries to be able to say something about rates of return.

Difficult to know the pre-degree salaries... and probably they vary a lot, since people do unqualified jobs before their studies.

Anyways, your post was not unclear, it just arose that question for me.
Generally speaking I would advise people to go for a MIM (or a diferent master in Economics, according to the specialization I chose in my studies, and to my career plan), if they are holding a bachelor, and only after the Master start working. Even if they already plan to do an MBA afterwards. Thats a personal preference of course.

But at the same time, I would not pay so much money for a MIM. I think an MBA is a very good investment, with a, to a certain extend predictable, return.
The benefit of doing a regular Master degree I see more in the scientific and intellectual level you reach, that's what I find interesting about doing a pre exp. Master. In that sense it does not need to be as expensive, because you don't need to do it at a school with a great name, just a good school.

If I had to do it, Iwould do only a top MIM (in Spain Esade and IE) with a 1minimum work experience, but as a Spanish I would prefer to do it outside (ie Boconni or HEC).

Dos:
-when you are young (up to 25)
- 100% in English
-preferably outside of your country
-with a little experience (6 month)
-top school (despite the price, it´s worth) and top ranked
-fulltime
-international environment (school, students and recruiters)

Katalina, correct me if I'm wrong, but I think you are confusing two types of pre-experience Master degrees.

Some of them have a research focus and are usually a first step before a PhD degree. Those are usually called "Masters of Science" (MSc's). I think those are the Masters that you have in mind when you say that pre-experience degrees have a more academic orientation. But there are also pre-experience Masters in Management that have a more "professional" orientation and in that sense are more similar to MBA degrees. The Masters that you have in AMBA's PEMM accreditation web page or in the Financial Times ranking of European Masters belong to the second category. They have a "professional" orientation.

Sure, I know the difference between MSc and MIM, but I still think that a Master, also a MIM, is worth less investement of money than a MBA, since the latter (if a good one) means significantly higher responsibility and higher salary.
I thought the advantage as well of the more professionally oriented MIM was be to acquire more knowlege and more skills... that's how I meant it.

But when I read Single Spain, it DOES look like a smart idea to do en expensive MIM. Then my question: What value do recruiters see in a MIM from IE for instance?
Or more generally speaking: what is the exact purpose of a MIM according to you?

My opinion is that MIM should be well regarded by recruiters. As for the purpouse, that depends on you. I would say that it´s appropiate for graduates aiming to entry counsulting or banking for junior positions as well as for multinationals such as Procter, Johnson & Johnson,... (a edge in fron of a graduate).

Is in better in your opinion to do a bachelor, then MIM and start the career, or do a bachelor, work some years, and go for an MBA?
Probably both combined... ;-)

But if you have to chose (for financial reasons as me), what do you advise?

Why did this thread stop ?!!
I am graduating very soon and am looking at these MIM and MSc programs. I know that everyone would agree that doing an MBA after having some work-ex would be a better deal. But what about those who want to start working in a corporate world but cant because they dont have a degree related to business. I am an engineering graduate and want to switch streams and get into the business world. So then wouldn't MIM or MSc from one of the top -10 univs in Europe be advisable ?!

I also would like to know the answer, but I cannot find any other thread her in which the differences between a MSc in business and a MIM are. Any help?

Mitsinbits,

I don't know any serious statistics on salaries for MIM graduates. My guess is that an MIM will give you access to the same types of jobs that you would be able to access with a BA in Business. You should ask yourself a couple of questions:

1) Given that you already have an engineering degree, wouldn't you be able to already access those jobs? If your degree is well reputed, some employers would hire you and give you some business training. You could then consider an MBA later on.

2) If the answer to 1) is 'no', then an MIM would open some opportunities for you. But I think it would make you no better (and no worse) than someone with a good BA in business. This means that your salary will not be extremely high -you won't be hired as a manager and will have to work your way up. So you need some careful financial planning. For example, the MIM at IE costs 32,000 euros. I'd be surprised if you could get a decent rate of return on that investment. Just for the sake of comparison, the MBA costs about 30% more than the MIM. Suppose the MBA at IE does give a good return on average. For you to get a similar return, you would need the MIM to raise your salary by just 30-percent less than the average MBA graduate. I may be wrong, but I don't think the MIM will raise your salary options by so much.

Hi, I did the MBA in the IE and the teaching and the school were extremely poor. they rank good because they are full with south american students and this gives the international taste.
On top the spanish market for MBA's is very low paid.
My suggestion is to stay away for IE, it is not good value for money.

Hi

I have an admit from IE in IMBA. I felt that the school ranks pretty high in the rankings ( almost all). Which of the programs did you attend . IMBA or Spanish MBA ?
Can you please elaborate why do you feel the MBA wasn't all that good. If so, why is it ranked so high.. I strongly believe that only diversity cannot be the criteria for it being ranked so high..

ks

@mandelson. When did you graduate from IE? If it was at the beginning of the financial crisis, then there might be other reasons for not being able to find a well-paying job.

Data from Businessweek.
Ethnicity/US Students in Program
Students from following regions:
Africa : 2 %
Asia: 14 %
Eastern Europe and Central Asia: 5 %
Latin America and the Caribbean: 38 %
Middle East: 2 %
North America: 9 %
Western Europe: 30 %

Data says that while there are many South Americans (as you say), there are also many non-South Americans (almost 70%). Similarly, you can expect a big chunk of students from Britain and its colonies in Oxford, France and its colonies in HEC, etc.

My research tells me that while IE does not yet carry the same pan-European brand power that INSEAD, IMD, and LBS do, its program strength seems to be up there with the top tier and as good as if not better than Bocconi, RSM, HEC, and Oxford. This is not FT's or Economist's or my perception but a result of a comprehensive employer review conducted by QS earlier this year.

I'm not saying you are wrong. After all you have seen the IE program first hand and I'm still deciding which school to go to. My question is - did you go to IE expecting to learn what they are good at teaching? I notice that IE is seen as a real master at entrepreneurship but weaker in certain other areas such as finance. If you wanted to be a highly-paid investment banker, I don't think IE could have met your expectations the way INSEAD or especially LBS, which is considered very strong at finance, could have.

I really want to hear your thoughts on the above and sincerely hope that your job search is going well if you haven't found one already!

If he was in a class with mostly South Americans, maybe he was in the Spanish language program. I have heard that schools are ranked only on their English language MBA programs. So, maybe that course is better at IE. I imagine there would be many more international professors in the English program, and a more diverse student body.

Hi there, please find an overview about the difference between MBA and MiM in the blog section http://blog.find-mba.com/

Thomas (EMBA IE Business School 2007)